From kaze0010 at umn.edu Tue May 10 17:07:26 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Tue May 10 17:12:18 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] tonight's meeting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050510170726.00b532a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Hello, If anyone wants to show up for a meeting, I'll be upstairs at Dunn Bros tonight, most likely in the southwest corner above the stairs. I'll be there between 6:30 to 7:30, maybe later too. From tanner at real-time.com Wed May 11 16:07:14 2005 From: tanner at real-time.com (Bob Tanner) Date: Wed May 11 16:07:22 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] Average packet loss and latency? Message-ID: <200505111607.15403@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> I'm working with one of the local wisp in the metro area. Using several different tools and different analysis methods, I'm seeing, on average: 8% loss 92ms ping times With as much as 50% loss and 5000ms ping times. The sample data is from 2 weeks of 24x7 monitoring. I do not have access to our side of the wifi link, so the monitoring is the public side of the firewall and the remote site of the wifi link. I talked to the technical support people and was told 5% to 8% loss, given utilization is 'ok' and 8ms to 10ms is acceptable ping times. The 'ok' and acceptable numbers seem really high to me. Any comments? -- Bob Tanner | Phone : (952)943-8700 http://www.real-time.com, Minnesota, Linux | Fax : (952)943-8500 Key fingerprint = AB15 0BDF BCDE 4369 5B42 1973 7CF1 A709 2CC1 B288 From andyw at pobox.com Wed May 11 16:31:00 2005 From: andyw at pobox.com (Andy Warner) Date: Wed May 11 16:33:24 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] Average packet loss and latency? In-Reply-To: <200505111607.15403@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com>; from tanner@real-time.com on Wed, May 11, 2005 at 04:07:14PM -0500 References: <200505111607.15403@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-time.com> Message-ID: <20050511163100.J3876@florence.linkmargin.com> Bob Tanner wrote: > I'm working with one of the local wisp in the metro area. > [...] > The 'ok' and acceptable numbers seem really high to me. Any comments? Can you supply any more data ? It's impossible to have a useful opinion given the sketchy facts provided. I'm thinking of: o link type (ptp, ptmp) o if ptmp - what's the client:ap ratio o what manufacturer/equipment o wep/wpa/etc active o link characteristics (length, antenna etc) o how are you measuring packet loss (at the MAC level, or at the IP level) o channel utilisation o what's the distribution of the delay Off the cuff, 5% packet loss at the IP level isn't that out of the ordinary for ptmp. Without knowing the distribution of the delay, it's not useful to speculate on it. -- andyw@pobox.com Andy Warner Voice: (612) 801-8549 Fax: (208) 575-5634 From kaze0010 at umn.edu Wed May 11 23:25:49 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Wed May 11 23:31:28 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] Average packet loss and latency? In-Reply-To: <200505111607.15403@www.mn-linux.org.or.transmuter.real-tim e.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050511232549.00b532a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> At 04:07 PM 5/11/2005 -0500, Bob Tanner wrote: >I'm working with one of the local wisp in the metro area. > >Using several different tools and different analysis methods, I'm seeing, on >average: > > 8% loss > 92ms ping times > >With as much as 50% loss and 5000ms ping times. > > >The sample data is from 2 weeks of 24x7 monitoring. > >I do not have access to our side of the wifi link, so the monitoring is the >public side of the firewall and the remote site of the wifi link. > >I talked to the technical support people and was told 5% to 8% loss, given >utilization is 'ok' and 8ms to 10ms is acceptable ping times. > >The 'ok' and acceptable numbers seem really high to me. Any comments? I'd agree that these packet loss levels seem high. I've read and personally observed that packet loss levels about 5% tend to make a really lousy connections for interactive traffic like ssh and RDP(remote desktop). Packet loss on my neighborhood WLAN is generally under 1%, usually around 0.5% (half a percent). I do see rare spikes of 100% loss that usually goes away within 5 minutes or so. Do you have any info on the signal-to-noise ratios for that wireless link? It seems that you have a marginal connection that is fading in and out. Maybe a different antenna would help? If you have access to the config parameters, you may also benefit from setting the WLAN bitrates to lower settings (e.g. instead of 11 mbps, set it at 2 mbps). -Haudy From sulrich at botwerks.org Sat May 14 10:25:50 2005 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Sat May 14 10:28:04 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] administravia - Newsletter from O'Reilly UG Program, May 13 References: Message-ID: <8563AA82-E1A2-4A42-BCCD-16A75796F5B1@botwerks.org> ================================================================ O'Reilly UG Program News--Just for User Group Leaders May 13, 2005 ================================================================ -Put Up an O'Reilly Where 2.0 Conference Banner, Get a Free Book -Looking for Amateur Astronomers -Safari Affiliate Program for User Groups ---------------------------------------------------------------- Book Info ---------------------------------------------------------------- ***Review books are available Copies of our books are available for your members to review-- send me an email and please include the book's ISBN number on your request. Let me know if you need your book by a certain date. Allow at least four weeks for shipping. ***Please send copies of your book reviews Email me a copy of your newsletters or book reviews. For tips and suggestions on writing book reviews, go to: http://ug.oreilly.com/bookreviews.html ***Discount information Don't forget to remind your members about our 20% discount on O'Reilly, No Starch, Paraglyph, Pragmatic Bookshelf, SitePoint, and Syngress books and O'Reilly conferences. Just use code DSUG. ***Group purchases with better discounts are available Please let me know if you are interested and I can put you in touch with our sales department. ---------------------------------------------------------------- General News ---------------------------------------------------------------- ***Put Up an O'Reilly Where 2.0 Conference Banner, Get a Free Book We're looking for user groups to display our conference banner on their web sites. If you send me the link to your group's site with our O'Reilly Where 2.0 Conference banner, I will send you the O'Reilly book of your choice. Where 2.0 Conference Banners: http://ug.oreilly.com/banners/where/ ***Looking for Amateur Astronomers I am looking for reviewers for our upcoming "Astronomy Hacks" book. If you or someone you know can write a review for Amazon, I'd be happy to send you our book. Thanks for your help. ***Safari Affiliate Program for User Groups Give your members access to content from Safari's thousands of technology books, right on your site--for free--and raise money for your user group at the same time. For more information and to sign up for the Safari Affiliate Program, go to: http://ug.oreilly.com/safari_affl.html?CMP=EMC-U1L284871961 ================================================================ O'Reilly News for User Group Members May 13, 2005 ================================================================ ---------------------------------------------------------------- Book News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -GDB Pocket Reference -Deploying Citrix MetaFrame Presentation Server 3.0 -Digital Audio Essentials -802.11 Wireless Networks: The Definitive Guide, 2nd Edition -Don't Click on the Blue E! -Visual Basic 2005: A Developer's Notebook -The Art of Project Management -Visual C# 2005: A Developer's Notebook -iMovie HD and iDVD 5: The Missing Manual -Access Hacks -MAKE Subscriptions Available ---------------------------------------------------------------- Upcoming Events ---------------------------------------------------------------- -Cary Millsap at the NoCOUG Spring Conference, Sunnyvale, CA--May 19 -Mike Clark ("Pragmatic Project Automation") at Agile Denver, Boulder, CO--May 23 -O'Reilly Sponsors the Coalition Summit for IPv6, Reston, VA--May 23-26 -Dan Gillmor ("We the Media"), WTC's Technology Breakfast Series, Mountain View, CA--May 26 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Conference News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -Registration is Open for the O'Reilly Open Source Convention, Portland, OR--August 1-5 -Where 2.0 Conference Registration Open, San Francisco, CA--June 29-30 -EuroOSCON Call for Papers Now Open, Amsterdam, The Netherlands--October 17-20 ---------------------------------------------------------------- News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -How to Build a Nonprofit for Your Community -Addison-Wesley Professional on SafariU -The Geospatial Web: A Call to Action -Learning Lab: Certificate Series $200 Instant Rebate -Tales of Rescuing Old Hardware -(No Starch) Author describes keys to business-ready Linux clusters -CVS Trouble -The Soul of WWDC 2005 -Build a Dashboard Widget -Magnificent Seven: What's New for Users in QuickTime 7 -O'Reilly books Recommended on AARP's article "Windows: Better Safe (Mode) Than Sorry" -Putting A Browser Into Your Windows Application -Five Things I Love About Spring -Configuring Database Access in Eclipse 3.0 with SQLExplorer -Ed Carreon: Making the Connection -Hands On: Create Insane Reason Grooves -On the Go with the Motorola MPx220 Camera Phone -Build an eCommerce Application with eZPublish -Radical Interface Approaches -Validate User Input in PHP 5 -MAKE: Audio -Call MAKE -MAKE: Weather ================================================ Book News ================================================ Did you know you can request a free book to review for your group? Ask your group leader for more information. For book review writing tips and suggestions, go to: http://ug.oreilly.com/bookreviews.html Don't forget, you can receive 20% off any O'Reilly, No Starch, Paraglyph, Pragmatic Bookshelf, SitePoint, or Syngress book you purchase directly from O'Reilly. Just use code DSUG when ordering online or by phone 800-998-9938. http://www.oreilly.com/ ***Free ground shipping is available for online orders of at least $29.95 that go to a single U.S. address. This offer applies to U.S. delivery addresses in the 50 states and Puerto Rico. For more details, go to: http://www.oreilly.com/news/freeshipping_0703.html ---------------------------------------------------------------- New Releases ---------------------------------------------------------------- ***GDB Pocket Reference Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596100272 Covering several popular programming languages, this handy guide details the essentials of using GDB in a testing environment. This book shows you how to specify a target for debugging, perform a careful examination to find the cause of program failure, and make quick changes for further testing. Having a quick way to refer to GDB's essential functions is the key to making the process work smoothly, and this book is the only reference you'll need. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/gdbpr/ ***Deploying Citrix MetaFrame Presentation Server 3.0 Publisher: Syngress ISBN: 193226650X This book covers all the topics needed to plan, design, and implement a reliable, scalable server-based computing solution in a Citrix/Windows 2003 environment. Whether you're building thin client environments for disaster recovery purposes or rolling Citrix MetaFrame out as the network model for the day-to-day activities of a company, you will find this book to be a great resource. It also offers invaluable advice and direction on optimization, redundancy, troubleshooting, and scalability. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/193226650X/ ***Digital Audio Essentials Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596008562 This indispensable reference helps you avoid time-consuming, costly trial and error in downloading audio files, burning CDs, converting analog music to digital form, publishing music to and streaming from the web, setting up home stereo configurations, and creating your own MP3 and other audio files. Designed for both Mac and PC users, it includes reliable hardware and software recommendations, tutorials, resources, and it even explains the basics of the DMCA and intellectual property law. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/digaudio/ Chapter 16, "Setting Up an Internet Radio Station," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/digaudio/chapter/index.html ***802.11 Wireless Networks: The Definitive Guide, 2nd Edition Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596100523 If you want to deploy your own wireless network, this book is the perfect starting place to gain an understanding of the capabilities and risks associated with the 802.11 protocols. This updated edition covers everything you need to know about integrating wireless technology into your current infrastructure. Designed with the system administrator or serious home user in mind, it's a no-nonsense guide for setting up 802.11 on Windows and Linux. Chapter 21, "Logical Wireless Network Architecture," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/802dot112/chapter/index.html ***Don't Click on the Blue E! Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596009399 For anyone who has grown disenchanted with Internet Explorer, this book is here to help. With its straightforward approach, it gives non-technical users a step-by-step roadmap for switching to a better web browser: Firefox. As the only book that covers the switch to Firefox, this how-to guide is a must for all those who want to browse faster, more securely, and more efficiently. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/bluee/ A sample excerpt, "Safety and Security," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/bluee/chapter/index.html ***Visual Basic 2005: A Developer's Notebook Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596007264 This practical book offers nearly 50 hands-on projects in an informal, code-intensive style. Each project explores a new feature of the language, with emphasis on changes that can increase productivity, simplify programming tasks, and help you add new functionality to your applications. This one-of-a-kind book also offers suggestions for further experimentation and links to online documentation and other sources of information. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/vbadn/ Chapter 2, "The Visual Basic Language," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/vbadn/chapter/index.html ***The Art of Project Management Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596007868 In this book, you'll learn from a veteran manager of software and web development how to plan, manage, and lead projects. This personal account of hard lessons learned over a decade of work in the industry distills complex concepts and challenges into practical nuggets of useful advice. Inspiring, funny, honest, and compelling, this is the book you and your team need to have within arm's reach. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/artprojectmgmt/ Chapter 3, "How to Figure Out What to Do," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/artprojectmgmt/chapter/index.html ***Visual C# 2005: A Developer's Notebook Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 059600799X This unique "all lab, no lecture" guide covers all of the great new features in C# with 50 hands-on projects. Each project explores a new feature, with emphasis on changes that increase productivity, simplify programming tasks, and add functionality to applications. You'll find suggestions for further experimentation, links to online documentation, plus practical notes and warnings. The book also shows developers how to acquire, install, and configure Visual Studio .NET 2005. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/visualcadn/ Chapter 1, "C# 2.0," is available online: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/visualcadn/chapter/index.html ***iMovie HD and iDVD 5: The Missing Manual Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596100337 For both professional and amateur moviemakers, David Pogue's witty and entertaining guide details every step of iMovie HD video production, from choosing and using a digital camcorder to burning the finished work onto DVDs. In addition, this book provides a firm grounding in basic film technique so that the quality of a video won't rely entirely on magic. It's your ultimate moviemaking-made-easy source. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/imoviehdtmm/ ***Access Hacks Publisher: O'Reilly ISBN: 0596009240 This valuable guide provides hands-on solutions to help users master Access. For experienced users, "Access Hacks" offers a unique collection of proven techniques and tools that will take their database skills and productivity to the next level. For Access beginners, this book helps them acquire a firm grasp of the program's most productive features. Topics covered range from utilizing SQL inquiries to working with Access in multi-user environments. http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/accesshks/ Sample Hack 61, "Use Excel Functions Inside Access," is available online (along with five others): http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/accesshks/chapter/index.html ***MAKE Subscriptions Available The annual subscription price for four issues is $34.95. When you subscribe with this link, you'll get a free issue--the first one plus four more for $34.95. So subscribe for yourself or friends with this great offer for charter subscribers: five volumes for the cost of four. Subscribe at: https://www.pubservice.com/MK/Subnew.aspx?PC=MK&PK=M5ZUGLA The MAKE blog is available at: http://www.makezine.com/blog/ ================================================ Upcoming Events ================================================ ***For more events, please see: http://events.oreilly.com/ ***Cary Millsap at the NoCOUG Spring Conference, Sunnyvale, CA--May 19 Author Cary Millsap ("Optimizing Oracle Performance") is giving a keynote address at the Northern California Oracle Users Group Spring Conference. http://www.nocoug.org/next.html ***Mike Clark ("Pragmatic Project Automation") at Agile Denver, Boulder, CO--May 23 Pragmatic Bookshelf author Mike Clark presents "Building Software, Better and Faster." You'll learn good practices (and see some bad ones) while you take a peek inside a well-oiled agile project that's using the essential practices covered in the Pragmatic Starter Kit: version control with Subversion, unit testing with JUnit, and automation with Ant and friends. http://www.agiledenver.org/2005MayMeeting.php ***O'Reilly Sponsors the Coalition Summit for IPv6, Reston, VA--May 23-26 Join leaders from dozens of forward-looking governments and companies shaping the New Internet at the Coalition Summit for IPv6. And keep an eye out for our new book "IPv6 Network Administration." http://www.coalitionsummit.com/ ***Dan Gillmor ("We the Media"), WTC's Technology Breakfast Series, Mountain View, CA--May 26 Author Dan Gillmor and other panelists discuss the impact open source has, not only on business strategy in developing revenue models, but also license implications and what open source development means for engineers. http://www.wtc-sf.org/eml_tbseries_052605.htm ================================================ Conference News ================================================ ***Registration is Open for the O'Reilly Open Source Convention, Portland, OR--August 1-5 OSCON 2005 explores three deep trends affecting open source: the commoditization of software, network-enabled collaboration, and software customizability. Join us at this essential gathering of open source leaders and practitioners of every persuasion to exchange ideas and push the boundaries of vital open source technologies. This year, we introduce the Open Source Business Review, along with a host of other exciting presentations and events. http://conferences.oreilly.com/oscon/ User Group members who register before June 20, 2005 get a double discount. Use code "os05grpusr" when you register, and receive 15% off the early registration price. To register for the conference, go to: http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/os2005/create/ord_os05 ***Where 2.0 Conference Registration Open, San Francisco, CA--June 29-30 Join us at the first O'Reilly Where 2.0 Conference. Location-based services and mapping are becoming mainstream technologies. Meanwhile, innovative new software makes it possible to apply the wealth of new data to old business problems. Come explore the emerging consumer and enterprise ecosystems around location-aware technologies that increasingly impact the way we work and play. http://conferences.oreilly.com/where/ User Group members who register before May 31, 2005 get a double discount. Use code "whereug" when you register, and receive 15% off the early registration price. To register for the conference, go to: http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/where2005/create/ord_where ***EuroOSCON Call for Papers Now Open, Amsterdam, The Netherlands--October 17-20 EuroOSCON 2005, to be held October 17-20 in Amsterdam, will explore the best and newest open source technologies, with a focus on what's particularly useful to companies, governments, and non-profits. Session and tutorial proposals are due by midnight, May 23rd. We're interested in all aspects of building applications, services, and systems that utilize the new capabilities of the open source platform. http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/eurooscon/create/e_sess Submit your proposal: http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/eurooscon/create/e_sess#form ================================================ News From O'Reilly & Beyond ================================================ --------------------- General News --------------------- ***How to Build a Nonprofit for Your Community Many open source projects have already created nonprofit organizations that support their communities, while other projects are considering ways to establish nonprofits. David Boswell details how mozdev.org built a nonprofit organization and shows you how to do the same for your community. He covers fundraising, obtaining legal advice, staffing, and more. David is the coauthor of "Creating Applications with Mozilla." http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/policy/2005/04/28/nonprofits.html ***Addison-Wesley Professional on SafariU SafariU, O'Reilly's web-based platform for creating, publishing, and sharing textbooks, now includes 416 Addison-Wesley Professional titles. With books covering topics from programming, data mining, AI, networking, security, web design, web programming, databases, and a whole range of subjects in between, Addison-Wesley is a welcomed addition to the SafariU repository. Log on to SafariU now to see this incredible new content. https://www.safariu.com/ ***The Geospatial Web: A Call to Action What needs to happen to build a sustainable geospatial web? Mike Liebhold offers ten steps designed to help tap the as yet unharvested business opportunities in a geospatial web. If this topic gets your creative juices flowing, you belong at O'Reilly's Where 2.0 Conference, coming up in June in San Francisco. http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/network/2005/05/10/geospatialweb.html ***Learning Lab: Certificate Series $200 Instant Rebate Learning programming languages and development techniques has never been easier. Using your web browser and Useractive's Learning Sandbox technology, the Learning Lab gives you hands-on, online training in a creative environment (and a Certificate from the University of Illinois College of Extended Education upon course completion). Only in May, receive a $200 instant rebate when you enroll in any Certificate Series. http://www.oreilly.com/redirector.csp?link=UACert&type=news --------------------- Open Source --------------------- ***Tales of Rescuing Old Hardware If you're careful, you can often pick up viable hardware from companies throwing out machines too old to run the latest and greatest Windows software. This is viable for free Unixes, if you can get past the installation. Mikhail Zakharov walks through a tale of exploration, discovery, and patch-writing to install NetBSD over NFS through the serial port of a Pentium I-era Toshiba notebook. http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2005/05/05/hardware_rescue.html ***No Starch Author describes keys to business-ready Linux clusters SearchEnterpriseLinux.com interviews Karl Kopper, author of No Starch's "Linux Enterprise Cluster." http://searchenterpriselinux.techtarget.com/originalContent/ 0,289142,sid39_gci1083586,00.html ***CVS Trouble Noel Davis looks at problems in CVS, PostgreSQL, Squid, Gaim, Debian's lsh, Xine-lib, Caroline, Convert-UUlib, Rootkit Hunter, snmppd, Kommander, kimgio, RealPlayer, Helix Player, xli, and Debian's samba. http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2005/05/06/ security_alerts.html --------------------- Mac --------------------- ***The Soul of WWDC 2005 A few years ago, Apple moved WWDC from San Jose to the brand new Moscone West building in San Francisco. The new location improved the face of its developer conference. This year, Apple wants to enhance its very soul. Here's how O'Reilly is going to help them do that. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2005/05/03/wwdc.html ***Build a Dashboard Widget A little HTML, a dash of JavaScript, and a sprinkle of CSS and you can create your own Dashboard widget. Andrew Anderson shows you how. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2005/05/06/dashboard.html ***Magnificent Seven: What's New for Users in QuickTime 7 Tiger is cool, but it's not the only new cat on the block. Apple has also released an updated version of QuickTime. Chris Adamson examines the user-visible features and changes in QT 7, including QT 7 Pro, renovations to the QuickTime Player application, and the implications of the powerful new H.264 video codec. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2005/05/10/qt7.html --------------------- Windows/.NET --------------------- ***O'Reilly books Recommended on AARP's article "Windows: Better Safe (Mode) Than Sorry" Gabe Goldberg's states "Windows XP books' indexes provided surprisingly few entries for Safe Mode. I found the best coverage in two O'Reilly books, 'Windows XP Pro: The Missing Manual' and 'Windows XP Home Edition: The Missing Manual.'" In addition to writing for www.aarp.org, Gabe contributes to the "Washington Post" and computer industry/trade publications. He's active in his local PC user group, CPCUG (Capital PC User Group) serving as Outreach Director and Program Director. He's also Region 2 Advisor for APCUG, helping user groups from VA to NJ. Thanks Gabe! http://www.aarp.org/learntech/computers/howto/better_safe_mode.html ***Windows XP Annoyances Needed for New Book We're looking for your gripes, complaints, hassles, and other frustrations with Microsoft's favorite OS. Billions of people use Windows, and we want to help them...and your help would be much appreciated. We'll be covering XP in all its flavors (including XP with Service Packs 1 and 2, Windows Media Center Edition), and in all its settings (from standalone PCs to running on a WiFi network). If you have an annoyance you'd like to see solved, email marsee@oreilly.com with "Windows XP Annoyances" in the subject line. Just note which version of XP your're using (with SP1? SP2? Windows Media Center Edition?) As thanks for sharing, we'll make sure to get copies of "Windows XP Annoyances" sent to your group shortly after publication. ***Putting A Browser Into Your Windows Application There are times when it would be awfully convenient to have the capabilities of Internet Explorer inside your Windows application. The classic case is when you want to look at an XML document, and you'd like to take advantage of IE's ability to show the document as a collapsible and expandable hierarchy. In this article, Jesse Liberty will show you how to do that, in just a few easy steps. http://www.ondotnet.com/pub/a/dotnet/2005/05/10/liberty.html --------------------- Java --------------------- ***Five Things I Love About Spring For hardcore enterprise development, Bruce Tate turns to Spring, the topic of his latest collaboration, "Spring: A Developer's Notebook." In this article, Bruce describes five reasons why he's hooked on Spring. http://www.onjava.com/pub/a/onjava/2005/05/11/spring.html ***Configuring Database Access in Eclipse 3.0 with SQLExplorer It's 2005 and you're using Eclipse. Should you still be creating your database tables and seeding them with data by hand, from an SQL command-line utility? Deepak Vohra introduces the SQLExplorer plugin for Eclipse, which allows you to put a GUI on your development-time database access. http://www.onjava.com/pub/a/onjava/2005/05/11/sqlexplorer.html --------------------- Digital Media --------------------- ***Ed Carreon: Making the Connection During a four-month visit to a remote village in Mexico, Ed Carreon photographed a world with one foot still in the past, a distant place he had heard about as a boy through family stories. His images capture the beauty and the struggle of a land that few of us will ever see. http://digitalmedia.oreilly.com/2005/05/11/featured.html ***Hands On: Create Insane Reason Grooves Don't settle for the same loop everyone else is using! This MP3-packed tutorial shows how to blast beats apart in Propellerhead Reason, then shape them into unique, twisted grooves. http://digitalmedia.oreilly.com/2005/05/04/reasonbeat.html ***On the Go with the Motorola MPx220 Camera Phone The Motorola MPx220 is a 3.88-ounce, portable multimedia tool cleverly disguised as a mobile phone. The ROM-based Microsoft Windows Media Player can play back MP3 and WMA audio, as well as WMV video files. The integrated camera can record 1.3-megapixel still photos. Todd Ogasawara explores all in this in-depth review. http://digitalmedia.oreilly.com/2005/05/04/mpx220.html --------------------- Web --------------------- ***Build an eCommerce Application with eZPublish Launch into the world of ecommerce using eZ publish. Bard Farstad explains step-by-step how to create a fully functional product catalogue with online credit card processing functionality. http://www.sitepoint.com/article/ecommerce-website-ez-publish ***Radical Interface Approaches Alex Walker takes a look at several web sites which feature radical interfaces for users. Read along and find out what's possible with just a little bit of imagination. http://www.sitepoint.com/blog-post-view.php?id=261889 ***Validate User Input in PHP 5 Discover how to validate user data in PHP and produce user-friendly error messages when something goes wrong, or when someone attempts a malicious attack. http://www.sitepoint.com/blog-post-view.php?id=261554 --------------------- MAKE --------------------- ***MAKE: Audio Here's the latest audio from MAKE Magazine. In this MAKE audio show, Cory Doctorow talks about the Brodcast Flag--it's history, the fight, and now its (hopeful) permanent demise. Right click or Control + click to download this MP3 to you local system or add the MAKE Audio feed to your podcasting application and get the show automatically! http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/make_podcast/ ***Call MAKE Call in to our MAKE voicemail and ask a question; anything is fine. How about something like, "I have an old PC, what can I do with it?" We'll try and answer these on our audio program or on the MAKE: Blog. It's not a toll-free call, so keep that in mind. 206-888-6253 (MAKE) ***MAKE: Weather http://makezine.com/weatherlink/ More about our Weather Experiment http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/2005/04/davis_vantage_p.html ================================================ From Your Peers =============================================== ***Don't forget to check out the O'Reilly UG wiki to see what user groups around the globe are up to: http://wiki.oreillynet.com/usergroups/index.cgi -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC From becky at pihl.us Sun May 15 10:47:56 2005 From: becky at pihl.us (Becky_Pihl) Date: Sun May 15 10:48:22 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network; Please contact Gary Schiff regarding Message-ID: <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> To: Steve Ulrich, TCWUG, TCWUG info &/or TCWUG Webmaster and Minneapolis City Councilmember Gary Schiff (Ward 9), cc: the "tcwug-list@tcwug.org" list server: Gents: I went to the Mpls DFL convention this past Saturday May 14th. (No Endorsement for Mayor; WHAT A WASTE OF TIME!!!) While there, I had a brief conversation with my councilman, Mr. Gary Schiff, of Ward 9 (http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/council/ward9/). I mentioned to him: the TCWUG.org web site (http://www.tcwug.org/), how you have meetings (http://www.tcwug.org/meetings/index.html), typically every second Tuesday of the month, how your organization is better informed as to Wi-Fi (and Wi-Max) issues than most other people, and my concern that the proposed City of Minneapolis' Wi-Fi network be "done right", including (but not limited to) compatibility with Wi-Fi versus Wi-Max. * I hope that this memo, sent to all of you, will start a conversation between the TCWUG and Mr. Schiff, such that Councilmember Schiff, one of the decision makers regarding the proposed Wi-Fi network in Minneapolis, will be better informed with his own questions, concerns &/or requirements when the city's staff comes to him with the proposed system. * Please invite him, or his aide, to one of your meetings such that you can exchange information, and hopefully result in a better Wi-Fi system down the road. * At the very least, please send him some sort of a summary of your concerns so that he can pass them along to the relevant staff members. Thank you, Leif O. Pihl . From kaze0010 at umn.edu Sun May 15 12:57:06 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Sun May 15 13:02:24 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network;Please contact Gary Schiff regarding In-Reply-To: <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Hello, I'd be more than happy to help answer any questions Mr. Schiff or others may have in regards to wireless. In general, some of my concerns/suggestions regarding wireless are: 1.) that the state does not prohibit city-initiated wireless networks as happened in Pennsylvania. Cities should not need to get permission from private companies in order to build infrastructure. 2.) ultimately, the city should own/control the system, although it may make sense to contract the day-to-day operations out to a private company (the system itself shouldn't become private property or be sold to a private corporation). 3.) some form of access should be available to visitors to Minneapolis (i.e. nonsubscribers). Perhaps non-subscribers could have a bandwidth limited connection (e.g. 256kbps). 4.) have a way to contribute to/participate in the system without requiring subscribing and monthly fees. For this I suggest that current broadband users could make their connections publicly available to anyone authorized to use the Mpls system, and in return they would receive authorization to use the Mpls system. The authorization check could be handled by contacting a central auth server. The broadband users wishing to make this kind of arrangement could pick up a customizable wireless device such as the Linksys WRT54G that was preloaded with one of the free WRT54G firmwares. The preloaded firmware would be set up to handle the authentication needs. A WRT54G usually costs between $45-$75. (I should mention that part of this idea of users putting up an open AP and in return getting access to other APs came from something I heard or read about a year ago, but I don't recall where. It may have been a Cringely article.) 5.) security: use a VPN over 802.11b/g instead of WEP/WPA. Using the VPN should be optional, but a captive portal that only permits HTTP/HTTPS traffic could periodically (say every 10-15 minutes) remind users that they are not using a VPN secured connection, and give them info how to use the VPN. 6.) roaming: something like SOWN's TransparentMobility system would be very very nice (http://www.sown.org.uk/index.php/TransparentMobility). Then you can roam between access points without losing your open connections. This is very important for things like VOIP or SSH sessions. 7.) it'd be good to have a way to allow wireless enthusiasts to participate at a higher level in the system 8.) radio frequency coordination issues (using 802.11b/g for client connections, and 802.11a or physical cabling for backbone links). 9.) bandwidth management software is necessary to prevent one client from using too many resources. Tools include Frottle, Wondershaper and others. -Haudy Kazemi At 10:47 AM 5/15/2005 -0500, Becky_Pihl wrote: >To: >Steve Ulrich, TCWUG, >TCWUG info &/or TCWUG Webmaster and >Minneapolis City Councilmember Gary Schiff (Ward 9), > > cc: the "tcwug-list@tcwug.org" list server: > > >Gents: >I went to the Mpls DFL convention this past Saturday May 14th. >(No Endorsement for Mayor; WHAT A WASTE OF TIME!!!) >While there, I had a brief conversation with my councilman, Mr. Gary >Schiff, of Ward 9 >(http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/council/ward9/). > >I mentioned to him: >the TCWUG.org web site (http://www.tcwug.org/), >how you have meetings (http://www.tcwug.org/meetings/index.html), >typically every second Tuesday of the month, >how your organization is better informed as to Wi-Fi (and Wi-Max) issues >than most other people, >and my concern that the proposed City of Minneapolis' Wi-Fi network be >"done right", including (but not limited to) compatibility with Wi-Fi >versus Wi-Max. > > >* I hope that this memo, sent to all of you, will start a conversation >between the TCWUG and Mr. Schiff, >such that Councilmember Schiff, one of the decision makers regarding the >proposed Wi-Fi network in Minneapolis, will be better informed with his >own questions, concerns &/or requirements when the city's staff comes >to him with the proposed system. > >* Please invite him, or his aide, to one of your meetings such that you >can exchange information, and hopefully result in a better Wi-Fi system >down the road. > >* At the very least, please send him some sort of a summary of your >concerns so that he can pass them along to the relevant staff members. > > > >Thank you, > > >Leif O. Pihl > > >. > > > >_______________________________________________ >Twin Cities Wireless Users Group Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tcwug-list@tcwug.org >http://mailman.tcwug.org/mailman/listinfo/tcwug-list > > From adam at whee.org Mon May 16 08:40:18 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon May 16 08:58:34 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network;Please contact Gary Schiff regarding In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> References: <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Message-ID: On Sun, 15 May 2005, Haudy Kazemi wrote: > 4.) have a way to contribute to/participate in the system without requiring > subscribing and monthly fees. For this I suggest that current broadband > users could make their connections publicly available to anyone authorized This is probably against your ISP's TOS, unless you specifically purchased bandwidth for resell. It would also make it nearly impossible to troubleshoot speed and connectivity issues, or provide any sort of bandwidth commitment, firewalling, etc. Also, consider the implications of roaming between AP's (and therefore, exitpoints to the Internet). Any sessions in-progress will terminate, since any incoming packets for you will be going to the 1st AP (the 2nd AP on a 2nd broadband connection will have a different public IP). And the 2nd AP won't have any existing NAT translations for you anyways (assuming the device is doing NAT, which it almost certainly would have to) I would therefore argue that #4 and #6 are mutually-exclusive. Even if that problem could be solved (by using PI space, and having participating ISP's that are providing bandwidth announce that space), NAT is still impossible because of the translation table problem. Unless there exists a clustered NAT product where all nodes of the cluster maintain copies of a single xlate table. I believe the new PIX v7 can do this, but I don't think it scales to this level. In short, I agree that sharing participant's broadband connections is a great idea IN THEORY, but the issues above make it more or less impossible to do in practice. Better would be to route all wireless traffic back to a central exitpoint to the Internet, or have a small number of "certified" exitpoints, where service levels and billing can be closely monitored and maintained. For instance, the city could colo boxes at a small number of ISP's. The box would have a wireless interface for an antenna on the roof, and would BGP peer with the ISP and announce the city's PI space. The city would have 100% control over these boxes, which would facilitate troubleshooting, monitoring, and billing (and later, HTTP proxies, firewalls, NAT, etc.) To get even more fancy, (and add a layer of complexity that would arguably provide little benefit compared to the headache of maintaining it...) These boxes could peer with each other over the wireless network (or more likely, with one of a handful of route reflectors, for scalability), and the box the user is connected to could make the decision that another box, on another ISP's network, has a better route to the destination, and re-route the traffic over the wireless, to a different exitpoint. Obviously, some traffic would be sent over the wireless twice, but this should be "cheaper" bandwidth than the colo bandwidth. In fact, at this point it starts to make sense to deploy one of these boxes with each AP, regardless of if the AP is at an exitpoint or not. Then you'd have a BGP speaker at each AP, which would make traffic engineering easier. Each AP would know the best exitpoint to route your traffic to, so it only gets routed over the wireless once. These boxes could also run Asterix (or something), and you could have each exitpoint (at a participating ISP) have a VOIP phone to route support calls to, so the city wouldn't need to maintain their own helpdesk. (This is getting way out of hand) Since the city would have control over the box, it should be easy to fairly distribute support calls, and simple to watch #/duration of support calls so the ISP's could be paid accordingly. The techs would have to have some sort of standard training and troubleshooting guides, and there'd have to be a shared ticket system...yada yada. All of the above is stream-of-conciousness, I haven't really put the time and thought into any of it. I'm supposed to be working. Adam Maloney From mail at RobWentworth.com Mon May 16 11:09:18 2005 From: mail at RobWentworth.com (Rob Wentworth) Date: Mon May 16 11:12:35 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network; Please contactGary Schiff regarding References: <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Message-ID: <001801c55a31$9dc11020$6400a8c0@intranet> ------ > Also, consider the implications of roaming between AP's (and therefore, > exitpoints to the Internet). Any sessions in-progress will terminate, > since any incoming packets for you will be going to the 1st AP (the 2nd AP > on a 2nd broadband connection will have a different public IP). And the > 2nd AP won't have any existing NAT translations for you anyways (assuming > the device is doing NAT, which it almost certainly would have to) > >I would therefore argue that #4 and #6 are mutually-exclusive. ------ > Adam Maloney If you read the web page at the URL referenced in #6 -----: 6.) roaming: something like SOWN's TransparentMobility system would be very very nice (http://www.sown.org.uk/index.php/TransparentMobility). Then you can roam between access points without losing your open connections. This is very important for things like VOIP or SSH sessions. ----- you will see that the method described involves handing off the roaming connection by having the NEW access point tunnel to the OLD access point, which proxies the existing connection(s) in progress, thereby maintaining existing connections without changing the IP address. The end-user also maintains a consistent local IP address. The software is available at sourceforge and they are asking people to use it. One caveat is that it appears that Win32 and WinCE users are not able to participate at this time... Another caveat is that tunnelling consumes bandwidth from each access point to which a TCP connection was initiated, until that connection is closed. . From adam at whee.org Mon May 16 11:12:52 2005 From: adam at whee.org (Adam Maloney) Date: Mon May 16 11:28:35 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network; Please contactGary Schiff regarding In-Reply-To: <001801c55a31$9dc11020$6400a8c0@intranet> References: <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> <001801c55a31$9dc11020$6400a8c0@intranet> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 May 2005, Rob Wentworth wrote: > you will see that the method described involves handing off the roaming > connection by having the NEW access point tunnel to the OLD access > point, which proxies the existing connection(s) in progress, thereby > maintaining existing connections without changing the IP address. The Very cool. > end-user also maintains a consistent local IP address. The software is > available at sourceforge and they are asking people to use it. One > caveat is that it appears that Win32 and WinCE users are not able to As clients? If the tunneling is done entirely at the AP level, it should be transparent, no? I still maintain that my other points (support, billing, TOS, quality of service) still preclude using individual's broadband for net access. But it does solve the IP/NAT problem. Thanks for the follow-up. From kaze0010 at umn.edu Mon May 16 12:33:05 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Mon May 16 12:38:36 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network; Please contactGarySchiff regarding In-Reply-To: References: <001801c55a31$9dc11020$6400a8c0@intranet> <3.0.5.32.20050515125706.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> <001801c55a31$9dc11020$6400a8c0@intranet> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050516123305.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> At 11:12 AM 5/16/2005 -0500, Adam Maloney wrote: >On Mon, 16 May 2005, Rob Wentworth wrote: > >> you will see that the method described involves handing off the roaming >> connection by having the NEW access point tunnel to the OLD access >> point, which proxies the existing connection(s) in progress, thereby >> maintaining existing connections without changing the IP address. The > >Very cool. > >> end-user also maintains a consistent local IP address. The software is >> available at sourceforge and they are asking people to use it. One >> caveat is that it appears that Win32 and WinCE users are not able to > >As clients? If the tunneling is done entirely at the AP level, it should >be transparent, no? My understanding of SOWN's TransparentMobility system is that it will work with any IP client. Their goal was to design something that did NOT require special IP stacks on the clients or the installing of custom software. Per their website: "Transparent MobileIP (TMip) is a technology developed in house to SOWN, and aims to solve the key problem of migration between access points. As described on the Routing WIKI page, each 'cell' serves its mobile users within a unique (to consume & SOWN) subnet, such as 10.13.0.0/29 for OakhurstNode. Assuming that a client has been issued an IP address within this subnet via DHCP, if they now migrate to say the SUSUNode (which uses 10.13.2.0/29), they will lose connectivity. There are various solutions to this problem, but many require extra software on the client (such as protocol stack implementations). At SOWN we didn't want this, as we wanted every IPv4 host to be mobile, even small PDAs. Therefore, we developed a software package called TMip to solve this problem. At a snip, TMip provides the ability for hosts to migrate between physical subnets, without having to change IP, hence never losing connectivity or previously established sessions. This application is now live over SOWN, after we upgraded the SUSUNode to Pebble recently. However, the software is still under test/development, so we could do with as many nodes running it as possible to check that it all behaves as it should!" Here's some documentation for the project: http://www.slyware.com/projects_tmip.shtml >I still maintain that my other points (support, billing, TOS, quality of >service) still preclude using individual's broadband for net access. Support: Two classes of APs: primary APs setup and run by the Mpls wifi project, and participant APs run by enthusiasts. Support for the primary APs would go thru the Mpls wifi project. No support for participant APs, other than diagnostics checks to see if the participant APs appear to be working properly (basically pinging/tracerouting). The operators of participant APs should provide a current, frequently checked email address that complaints can be directed to. Billing: There is no separate billing. Just an authentication check for subscribers and participants via a publicly accessible webserver. Nonsubscribers could use a bandwidth limited connection, say 128kbps. TOS: While Comcast subscribers may have a TOS problem, anyone using Speakeasy.net would be okay in regards to the TOS: http://www.speakeasy.net/netshare/terms/#wifipolicy https://www.speakeasy.net/tos/ They do offer DSL service in the area: https://www.speakeasy.net/home/compare/ $40/month for 768/128 Another possibility is participant installation of APs that are wirelessly uplinked to the Mpls wifi system via high-gain directional antennas to serve areas outside of the regular service area. There need not be TOS issues in this case as Mpls wifi itself would be the uplink. Quality of service issues: The participant would be required to keep his AP powered and connected to the broadband connection. The captive portal page for a participant AP could have a clearly visible notice/banner that says "This is a participant AP, not a primary AP, and thus may not be as reliable as a primary AP." Bandwidth QOS can be handled inside of the AP, if it is an Linksys WRT54G or other Linux based AP such as a Soekris box. I see the participant APs as being a neat way to extend service to areas not covered by the regular service and as a way to contribute/participate. From sulrich at botwerks.org Mon May 16 12:46:43 2005 From: sulrich at botwerks.org (steve ulrich) Date: Mon May 16 12:48:35 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] Re: The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network; Please contact Gary Schiff regarding In-Reply-To: <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> References: <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> Message-ID: <27f9ecded0d8ee4ed1da082b579827fa@botwerks.org> all - in an attempt to provide some feedback to councilmember schiff that has some specific relevance, might i suggest that interested parties read the RFP (though from what i've read thus far it reads more like an RFI) which is available from the city of minneapolis web site. i've started a collection of links relative to the minneapolis wireless which is available here [1]. the first link there is to the city's web site which has a copy of the RFP and the associated appendices. which makes for educational reading in and of itself. (were you aware that there are approx. 6350 parking meters in minneapolis?) while the discussion that's taken place thus far is interesting. if there is a desire to effect a meaningful impact on the direction that the city takes with the network and the technologies selected it might be best to work with the structure that has been selected and provide meaningful input into the RFP as it stands as well as assisting as it makes sense in the review process. i.e.: RTFRFP. ;-) references ---------- [1] - http://del.icio.us/stevilbot/msp-wifi On May 15, 2005, at 10:47 AM, Becky_Pihl wrote: > To: > Steve Ulrich, TCWUG, > TCWUG info &/or TCWUG Webmaster and > Minneapolis City Councilmember Gary Schiff (Ward 9), > > cc: the "tcwug-list@tcwug.org" list server: > > > Gents: > I went to the Mpls DFL convention this past Saturday May 14th. > (No Endorsement for Mayor; WHAT A WASTE OF TIME!!!) > While there, I had a brief conversation with my councilman, Mr. Gary > Schiff, of Ward 9 > (http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/council/ward9/). > > I mentioned to him: > the TCWUG.org web site (http://www.tcwug.org/), > how you have meetings (http://www.tcwug.org/meetings/index.html), > typically every second Tuesday of the month, how your organization is > better informed as to Wi-Fi (and Wi-Max) issues than most other > people, and my concern that the proposed City of Minneapolis' Wi-Fi > network be "done right", including (but not limited to) compatibility > with Wi-Fi versus Wi-Max. > > > * I hope that this memo, sent to all of you, will start a conversation > between the TCWUG and Mr. Schiff, such that Councilmember Schiff, one > of the decision makers regarding the proposed Wi-Fi network in > Minneapolis, will be better informed with his own questions, concerns > &/or requirements when the city's staff comes to him with the > proposed system. > > * Please invite him, or his aide, to one of your meetings such that > you can exchange information, and hopefully result in a better Wi-Fi > system down the road. > > * At the very least, please send him some sort of a summary of your > concerns so that he can pass them along to the relevant staff members. > { snipped - misc. previous correspondence } -- steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC From kaze0010 at umn.edu Mon May 16 14:40:41 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Mon May 16 14:46:38 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] Re: The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network In-Reply-To: <27f9ecded0d8ee4ed1da082b579827fa@botwerks.org> References: <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> <42876F2C.1090406@pihl.us> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050516144041.025529a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Thanks for the link, Steve. I was just reviewing the RFP + addenda and it looks like today is the deadline for submitting questions, as mentioned here: http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/procurement/docs/addendum3.pdf ---copy/paste--- Any questions regarding this RFP should be submitted in writing to the CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS’ sole contact person: Mr. William E. Beck Director, BIS Business Development CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS 350 South Fifth Street, Room 127 Minneapolis, MN 55415 Email: broadband@ci.minneapolis.mn.us Fax: 612-673-2719 All questions are due no later than Monday, May 16, 2005, at 4:00 p.m. Central Daylight Time. Questions will be answered in writing and published on the CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS’ web site by Tuesday, May 31, 2005. The contact person above is the only individual that can be contacted about the project by Respondents before proposals are submitted. That contact MUST be in writing. The department contact cannot vary the terms of the RFP. ---end of copy/paste--- Pages 28-31 of the RFP are the most interesting in that they start to cover residential, mobile, and visitor access. Nothing in great detail...its more of questioning how various proposing contractors will address these issues and provide service. I didn't see anything in the RFP about low-speed, non-subscriber access, nor user-participation options. Pages 32-35 are technical questions including the requirement of no dead spots. One concern I have is the existance of dead spots can vary based on foliage cover and client card capabilities. Winter coverage should be better, summer worse. A 100 mw Cisco 350 PCMCIA card will work in many more locations than a $10 after rebate SMC wireless card. I hope they look at run-of-the-mill/middle-of-the-pack wireless devices when they determine coverage needs. "No special client software required for service, other than provided by the above standard operating systems." SOWN's system could handle that. -Haudy Kazemi At 12:46 PM 5/16/2005 -0500, steve ulrich wrote: >all - > >in an attempt to provide some feedback to councilmember schiff that has >some specific relevance, might i suggest that interested parties read >the RFP (though from what i've read thus far it reads more like an RFI) >which is available from the city of minneapolis web site. > >i've started a collection of links relative to the minneapolis wireless >which is available here [1]. the first link there is to the city's web >site which has a copy of the RFP and the associated appendices. which >makes for educational reading in and of itself. (were you aware that >there are approx. 6350 parking meters in minneapolis?) > >while the discussion that's taken place thus far is interesting. if >there is a desire to effect a meaningful impact on the direction that >the city takes with the network and the technologies selected it might >be best to work with the structure that has been selected and provide >meaningful input into the RFP as it stands as well as assisting as it >makes sense in the review process. > >i.e.: RTFRFP. ;-) > > >references >---------- > >[1] - http://del.icio.us/stevilbot/msp-wifi > > >On May 15, 2005, at 10:47 AM, Becky_Pihl wrote: > >> To: >> Steve Ulrich, TCWUG, >> TCWUG info &/or TCWUG Webmaster and >> Minneapolis City Councilmember Gary Schiff (Ward 9), >> >> cc: the "tcwug-list@tcwug.org" list server: >> >> >> Gents: >> I went to the Mpls DFL convention this past Saturday May 14th. >> (No Endorsement for Mayor; WHAT A WASTE OF TIME!!!) >> While there, I had a brief conversation with my councilman, Mr. Gary >> Schiff, of Ward 9 >> (http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.us/council/ward9/). >> >> I mentioned to him: >> the TCWUG.org web site (http://www.tcwug.org/), >> how you have meetings (http://www.tcwug.org/meetings/index.html), >> typically every second Tuesday of the month, how your organization is >> better informed as to Wi-Fi (and Wi-Max) issues than most other >> people, and my concern that the proposed City of Minneapolis' Wi-Fi >> network be "done right", including (but not limited to) compatibility >> with Wi-Fi versus Wi-Max. >> >> >> * I hope that this memo, sent to all of you, will start a conversation >> between the TCWUG and Mr. Schiff, such that Councilmember Schiff, one >> of the decision makers regarding the proposed Wi-Fi network in >> Minneapolis, will be better informed with his own questions, concerns >> &/or requirements when the city's staff comes to him with the >> proposed system. >> >> * Please invite him, or his aide, to one of your meetings such that >> you can exchange information, and hopefully result in a better Wi-Fi >> system down the road. >> >> * At the very least, please send him some sort of a summary of your >> concerns so that he can pass them along to the relevant staff members. >> > >{ snipped - misc. previous correspondence } > >-- >steve ulrich sulrich@botwerks.org >PGP: 8D0B 0EE9 E700 A6CF ABA7 AE5F 4FD4 07C9 133B FAFC > >_______________________________________________ >Twin Cities Wireless Users Group Mailing List - Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota >tcwug-list@tcwug.org >http://mailman.tcwug.org/mailman/listinfo/tcwug-list > > From kaze0010 at umn.edu Mon May 16 15:13:52 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Mon May 16 15:18:37 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] The proposed Mpls. Wi-Fi network Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050516151352.00b532a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> Hello Mr. Beck, I'm an area resident and a member of the Twin Cities Wireless Users Group (www.tcwug.org). I was reviewing the Minneapolis wireless RFP and had a few comments/concerns and questions/suggestions: Comments and Concerns: 1.) the state should not prohibit city-initiated wireless networks as happened in Pennsylvania. Cities should not need to get permission from private companies in order to build infrastructure. 2.) ultimately, the city should own/control the system, although it may make sense to contract the day-to-day operations out to a private company (the system itself shouldn't become private property or be sold to a private corporation). This appears to be the case with the current RFP. Questions and Suggestions: 3.) what about visitors to Minneapolis? Some form of access should be available to visitors (i.e. nonsubscribers). Perhaps non-subscribers could have a bandwidth limited connection (e.g. 128 kbps or 256kbps). 4.) what about people who want to contribute to/participate in the system without requiring subscribing and monthly fees? For this I suggest that current broadband users could make their connections publicly available to anyone authorized to use the Mpls system, and in return they would receive authorization to use the Mpls system. (For example, users with Speakeasy.net DSL subscriptions are permitted and encouraged in their TOS to share their connections.) The authorization check could be handled by contacting a central auth server. The broadband users wishing to make this kind of arrangement could pick up a customizable wireless device such as the Linksys WRT54G that was preloaded with one of the free WRT54G firmwares. The preloaded firmware would be set up to handle the authentication needs. A WRT54G usually costs between $45-$75. (I should mention that part of this idea of users putting up an open AP and in return getting access to other APs came from something I heard or read about a year ago, but I don't recall where. It may have been a Robert Cringely article.) (Other Linux based systems like the Soekris kits could be used). 5.) security: use a VPN over 802.11b/g instead of WEP/WPA. Using the VPN should be optional, but a captive portal that only permits HTTP/HTTPS traffic could periodically (say every 10-15 minutes) remind users that they are not using a VPN secured connection, and give them info how to use the VPN. 6.) How about roaming devices between access points? Something like SOWN's TransparentMobility system would be very very nice (http://www.sown.org.uk/index.php/TransparentMobility). Using the SOWN system, you can roam between access points without losing your open connections. This is very important for things like VPN, VOIP , or SSH sessions. The SOWN software is open source and freely available from Sourceforge.net. 7.) it'd be good to have a way to allow wireless enthusiasts to participate at a higher level in the system 8.) radio frequency coordination issues (using 802.11b/g for client connections, and 802.11a or physical cabling for backbone links). 9.) bandwidth management software is necessary to prevent one client from using too many resources. Tools include Frottle, Wondershaper and others. 10.) Coverage testing: Pages 32-35 of the RFP are technical questions that include the requirement of no dead spots. One concern I have is the existance of dead spots can vary based on tree foliage cover and client card capabilities. Winter coverage would likely be best, which could be a problem if coverage tests are performed in the winter only to find that summer coverage is spotty. Also, a 100 mw Cisco 350 PCMCIA card will work in many more locations than a cheap $10 after rebate SMC wireless card. I would hope that the coverage evaluation teams look at run-of-the-mill/middle-of-the-pack wireless devices when they determine coverage needs. This would probably mean testing coverage with several common PDAs (Palm/PocketPC), laptops with integrated wireless cards, and common add-on PCMCIA cards. Coverage testing with VOIP Wifi phones like the Cisco CP-7920 would also be appropriate. 11.) the requirement for "No special client software required for service, other than provided by the above standard operating systems." SOWN's system mentioned above could handle that and provide roaming capabilities without disrupting active connections. There is a discussion about some of these issues archived at: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tcwug-list/2005-May/thread.html along with a proposal for how to integrate "primary" Mpls-provided access points with "participant" access points that addresses the issues of support, billing, TOS, and quality of service: http://shadowknight.real-time.com/pipermail/tcwug-list/2005-May/002250.html Thanks, Haudy Kazemi ---copy/paste--- Any questions regarding this RFP should be submitted in writing to the CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS’ sole contact person: Mr. William E. Beck Director, BIS Business Development CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS 350 South Fifth Street, Room 127 Minneapolis, MN 55415 Email: broadband@ci.minneapolis.mn.us Fax: 612-673-2719 All questions are due no later than Monday, May 16, 2005, at 4:00 p.m. Central Daylight Time. Questions will be answered in writing and published on the CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS’ web site by Tuesday, May 31, 2005. The contact person above is the only individual that can be contacted about the project by Respondents before proposals are submitted. That contact MUST be in writing. The department contact cannot vary the terms of the RFP. ---end of copy/paste--- From kaze0010 at umn.edu Tue May 31 19:42:00 2005 From: kaze0010 at umn.edu (Haudy Kazemi) Date: Tue May 31 19:44:17 2005 Subject: [tcwug-list] June 7th meeting In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20050510170726.00b532a8@kaze0010.email.umn.edu> References: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20050531194200.0328fc70@127.0.0.1> Hello, Due to other plans, I will not be able to attend the June TCWUG meeting. Of course, the rest of you are more than welcome to get together if you like. Thanks -Haudy