----- Original Message -----
From: Joel R. Helgeson
To: tcwug-list at tcwug.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 11:28 PM
Subject: [TCWUG] They said "NO!" [Was Wireless Bridge, Passive Relay]


As you know, I am trying to build a wireless bridge by bouncing the signal
off a water tower with two parabolic dishes on top.  This setup would
require no radio.  I had contacted the City of Brooklyn Park to inquire
about putting an antenna atop their water tower.  They stated that they
would take my information and discuss it in a committee meeting. Their
response just went to prove that they are truly government employees and not
capitalists.  They said "No".  Plain and simple.

They stated that they didn't want private companies putting gear atop their
water tower for a bridge link.  They stated that if they did, they would
then have to offer the same thing to all the other businesses in the area
and they just didn't have the real estate atop the tower to support hundreds
of bridge relays. (?).

I told them that if demand increases, that's when they raise the price as
the space became at a premium.  I was completely flabbergasted by their
response. At no price did they want to give us access.  They apparently have
no problem giving access to big companies such as cellular carriers and WISP
's, etc, but as far as the private smaller companies are concerned, you're
S.O.L.

What are your thoughts on this?  Are these people dense?  I was astounded by
their decision.  They stated that if I wanted to appeal the decision, I
could take it to the City Council where I would have to explain to these
people what a wireless bridge is as they come up with irrelevant arguments
regarding their concerns about it interfering  with their cellular phone or
how it will impact homeland security.

Can you believe this?!

Joel R. Helgeson
Director of Networking & Security Services
SymetriQ Corporation, www.symetriq.com
8500 Normandale Lake Boulevard, Suite 1670
Bloomington, Minnesota 55437-3813
Office: (952) 921-8869
Cell: (651) 270-7521


"An investment in knowledge pays the best dividends." - Benjamin Franklin


They're smart, on a few counts. Number 1: Insurance. The big
WISPs/cell/radio people can afford to pay off the insurance companies if you
fall off the 100 foot water tower. Number 2: i'm sure they get inspected by
many authorities every year making sure they're within compliance of the
numerous mandates set by FCC, and local/state gov't. Number 3: "we don't
want private companies using it". Simply put, if they let you, then other
people would petition them to do the same thing. It becomes more a hastle
than it's worth at the weekly/monthly meetings.

Even though you think that putting 2 parabolic dishes atop a water tower
seems harmless enough, it's just another lightning rod to them, with
potential to damage property. Even though there's no radios up there to
generate a signal, you're still putting RF through them, which can, if not
aimed properly, bounce through grandma's living room, screwing up her heart
monitor system. A risk i'm sure the local health board would love to talk to
you about. :) There's so many other factors involved in just simply "putting
up a dish".

On the other hand, i'm sure many local governments would love a bit of extra
income to pay the bills, which confuses me at times. I know of a few people
who've worked on water towers, and the towns they're in (*cough matt hallacy
cough*) love the fact that they can provide this service to their
townspeople. But in the TC area, wireless is now becomming a touchy subject.
Lots of people getting into trouble warchalking/driving, and other seemingly
harmless things. So, from their perspective, i can understand. It's just
simply a liability at this point in the game.

Having worked at a college radio station for the past 3 months, and
installing obscene antennas atop the Sherburne Hall roof (tallest building
between mpls and fargo), and having wap11's get nailed by lightning, it's
not fun. I've installed my 24dBi dish on top the roof here at SCSU, aimed at
the local WISP, when i installed it (it's for the radio station's webcast,
for those who must know) the local people wanted to know what it was, was it
a danger, was it gonna mess with KARE-11's camera, was it gonna mess with
the FBI tower, was it gonna mess with the airport, etc etc. I had to write
to the school commissions that it was in fact installed properly, and not a
danger to anything else up there. It's not a pretty process to go through.
(the hardest people to convince that it was fine was the FBI. They're not
too keen on having it 60 feet away from their only relay radio in central
MN)


Having said that, i'd suggest calling the local co-op, i'm sure there's
somthing tall around there that's rentable for a semi-cheap price. Talk to
Matt Hallacy on that one, since the WISP he used to work for was housed off
the top of a grain elevator.


Just my $.02

--
Alex Hartman - goober at goobe.net - Asst. Engineer KVSC-FM
PGP Key fingerprint = 26 41 19 56 19 81 E2 BC  EE C8 1D F4 DB B8 ED B8
"Educational, public radio, 88.1 FM KVSC - St. Cloud"