Re: CF: more updates soon, comments/votes requested

[David Andrew Michael Noelle <dave@Straylight.org>]

> From: Peter Mardahl <peterm@langmuir.EECS.Berkeley.EDU>
> Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:10:33 -0700
> 
> > 
> > - Word of Recall
> 
> I vote no on this one.  I often consecrate neutral altars so that
> I can pray on them.  I'd *HATE* to get Recalled into some of
> the places I consecrate.  If you limit to maps with difficulty 0, maybe.

Good point.  I've often consecrated random altars in dungeons after
clearing the immediate area, so I could super-charge my grace before
continuing.  Recalling to such a place without making sure that it's
still clear would not be a good thing.

Perhaps it should not be automatic at all, but require the casting of
a seperate spell.  Temples could simply provide a relatively cheap way
of having someone else cast it for you if you don't happen to know the
spell yourself.


> > - Sacred weapons and armour
> 
> These are fine so long as the player cannot turn about and sell
> these relics for profit.

Not a problem.  I already took care of that.  Items improved by divine
intervention do not become any more valuable.  It doesn't really make
a whole lot of sense, but there doesn't seem to be a more reasonable
way to close that loophole.


> > - Hunger and starvation
> 
> How about reducing stats when food drops below 0?  It's fine as it is
> though:  you may be amused to hack this in too.

That doesn't happen immediately, but starting at -250, strength and
constitution are gradually depleted, and the lower the food drops, the
faster the stats drop.  Below -500, all seven stats start dropping off
faster and faster.


> > - Magic Recharge
> > 
> > Since nobody has said much of anything about my proposed god of magic,
> 
> Er, well, I'll comment now.  I've  no problem with the technical stuff:
> i.e., places to recharge sp, etc., but I'd prefer they be called (and
> thought of) as mage guilds.

I had no intention of replacing mage guilds with temples of magic.
Placing the recharge devices in mage guilds instead of, or in addition
to, temples to a god of magic, would make sense if guilds were ready
to be implemented.  They're not.  We need to work out more of the
details involved in seperating races and classes and exactly what
guilds are all about first.

For example, can anyone just walk into the mage guild to use the
recharge station?  Or are only mages allowed to enter?  Is there some
kind of partial membership option in between?  Seperate races and
classes might be better implemented after 0.96, while temples of magic
and recharge stations can be done now.


> I don't think mana works very well as a special case of godpower:

It doesn't.  In fact, magic as a special case of godpower is worse
than useless.  It actually cancels itself out and negates all the
godpower spells.  The whole point of godpower is being non-magical.
At least, in terms of attacktypes as currently implemented it does.
If magic as an attacktype is altered so that immunity to magic does
not confer complete immunity to all primary effects of anything
magical, that might change.


> I'd rather see this done as a mercantile operation rather than a
> religious one, in other words.

It don't see any reason why this service couldn't be provided by both
institutions, once both are available.  For now, I'd rather have mana
recharge available in a temple than not at all.


> > - Magical / Holy "grenades"
>
> I argue that since the creation of the random map generator, priests
> no longer need a "general" attacktype to advance levels:  we can
> randomly generate as much dungeon as they may need to advance.
> 
> Giving them a general attacktype just turns them into a weaker sort
> of mage rather than a distinct discipline with its own special mission.
> 
> I also don't see anything too outstandingly wrong with having worship
> of one god be more popular because that god does more "useful" stuff
> for his devotees.  I personally go for Valriel every time with
> the current mapset:  but there's nothing intrinsically wrong with
> any of the religions, just map deficiencies:  i.e., the mapset is deficient,
> not the priests.
> 
> I would rather see the maps fixed, therefore, and in fact, I wrote
> the random map generator with just this issue in mind.  Even with
> the current mapset, there's nothing really "wrong" with having one
> religion be more useful than others.

You're right.  Adding maps and/or creatures would probably be a better
solution.  I wasn't aware of this usage of the random map generator.
I was reacting more to the state of the current maps and the
difficulties priests have completing maps that aren't designed for
them.  There's really no reason every character should be able to
complete every quest, though.

Neither of these spells is really necessary, or even particularly
interesting, if other means of balancing priests and mages with the
warrior classes are pursued.  Changing the nature and/or rarity of
magic immunity would be an important step in making mages more
playable, and adding more quests and generic dungeons suited to the
various religions would be another.

-- 
            -Dave Noelle,                 dave@Straylight.org
            -the Villa Straylight,  http://www.straylight.org

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